…Are you Catholic or Protestant?” He said, “Protestant.”, I said, “Me too! Site hits with “anti” will also include supportive sites discussing discrimination, not just sites that are opposed to the religion in question; again, I did not differentiate. Persecution was practically the theme of the pageant after the restoration of the Gospel and the trek west. Some of what I found may surprise you. Maybe someday I’ll tell you the funniest ones that involve Mormonism. 99% of those who read it and don’t understand why it is misleading will never find out that it is. Because there is so much opposition to the movement, I thought it an important inclusion. Site hits with just religious name returned both supportive and non-supportive sites; I did not differentiate. Uh, you just called Scientology a religion…. The only question I have is this: Is the phrase “anti-” a Mormon phrase? I also believe that convert Latter-day Saints do not. My searches were done on March 28, 2008. Share this: Click to share on Facebook (Opens in … The candidate was a Berkley undergrad, BYU law student near the top of his class. I next googled the “anti” of each of these religions and found: Anti Ratio. I’d guess that most “anti” falls under this category, as I run into it quite often without noticing it’s “anti”. One question as to your methodology: do sites that oppose a religion classify themselves as “anti-“? getting tired of explaining who she was and what was this weird habit of walking she decided to use some other not very used roads and this is how she eventually became friends with the Amish up to this day. Discuss. Only 8% said head to the local pub. I think it’s fair to say, however, that using the search term “anti” probably underestimates the number of sites that oppose each group (from Mormons to Catholics to Muslims to athiests). But yet, the church promotes it as a massacre. Created Jun 16, 2009. That Mormons, in their distant past, experienced significant and sometimes intense persecution is a matter of historical fact. Older, traditional worshippers think Christians like me would be more holy if we dressed in “Sunday best” and sang traditional hymns. "Mormons continued to face persecution for their religious … As the Mormons searched for a place to build their Zion, they were met with an escalating campaign of persecution and mob violence. The extent to which Mormons still entertain a “persecution complex” is important, not only because it informs the way that Mormons understand themselves, but also because it also determines the way that Mormons relate to others. I agree. Competing religion “outreach” movements? Parley P. Pratt’s well-known autobiography, for instance, leans heavily on the evocative literature he wrote to depict the Saints’ ill treatment in Missouri. However, both “Mormonism” (0.20 ratio) and “Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints” (0.33 ratio) had a higher anti ratio on par with the Universal Unitarian, Jehovah’s Witness and Mennonite group above. In the historical sense, the Mormon “persecution complex” is not a theory to be verified or disproved. This is what we’re going to explore in our final topic – how would Jesus relate to Mormons? These are SUCH good people; they simply believe some horrible things about us and won’t listed because of the distortions they hear regularly in church and from the media.” He was absolutely right. Some hilarious hubris from Jeff Holland's talk at Windsor Castle. Read more. Tara was born at home and didn’t see a doctor or nurse until her adulthood. When 90+% of the people won’t even listen due to “bad press”, how can that be a good thing? For consistency sake, all numbers of hits are expressed in millions. Mormons today have abilities and opportunities–responsibilities, even–in relating to the larger world today that the past couldn’t dream of. ADD TO CART. To be clear, I am not even going to attempt to argue that persecution has … It seems that almost all the anti-Mormon stuff on the web comes from these ‘ex-Mormons’. Mormon History. Or that it is not an organized effort at a national level? I once was sitting in a law firm recruiting meeting. Every trailer for these movies is the same. 28. My husband and I had joined the LDS Church at age 25 after Mormon missionaries knocked on our front door. The article also cites the problems with churches having a persecution complex: #24 SAP – Scientology is not exactly a religion, but it’s not exactly a non-religion either. 1 The Origins of the Church 2 The … In the historical sense, the Mormon “persecution complex” is not a theory to be verified or disproved. For example, is the tone of anti-Mormon sites more heated, or less heated, than that found on Anti-JW sites? Is it essential for Mormons to maintain their belief to have a persecution complex? For example, I know that Scientologists (a group I assumed would have had a much higher “anti ratio”) are the subject to numerous anti videos. Church and ministry leadership resources to better equip, train and provide ideas for today's church and ministry leaders, like you. For example, Haun’s Mill was clearly a tragic and brutal event. $24.99. How do you think inclusion of YouTube material would skew the results? $19.99. For Mormonism, I have two separate search results based on the nickname Mormonism and the formal name Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. And I had never seen the resulting backlash play so easily into a Mormon persecution complex, transforming what was essentially an internal doctrinal position into a battleground between the church and its surrounding communities. *grin*. But then if we try to get our kids into a baptist or catholic school we will probably run into the subtle persecution that happens every day to Mormons. That is, I might call someone an anti-Mormon, but they might call themselves a countercultist or a missionary, or something that Google wouldn’t classify as “anti-.” I would assume that, in an anti-Mormon search, you’d get a large proportion of blogs decrying anti-Mormon sentiment, in an anti-Catholic, you’d get a lot of Catholic sites, etc. Ditto to what Andrew said. Being peculiar at any time certainly means dealing with tensions and ostracism. Thanks Hawkgrrl for the facts you have gathered. They’re motivated by two other drives; anger at having sacrificed so much of their lives, decisions, time and money to what is so easily shown to be a fraud, and an impulse to save other’s from doing the same. But Mormonism is fueled by a persecution complex. I agree with Sam B. Certainly that has been the case in Mormons’ history. The Church has outreach meetings for Spanish-speakers in Utah, but they’re not anti-Spanish speaker, or anti-Catholic, even. For goodness sakes…WE ARE PERSECUTED JUST LIKE THE JEWS!!! The Mormon Conspiracy Theorist post is yet to come! Exmormons. Perhaps do your own research or hire a group to determine similar or dissimilar results? Am I the persecutor as well as the persecuted? A significant number of the attorneys on the recruiting committee had developed a bias against non-drinkers because they weren’t as fun to party with. After all, like all Mormons I only believed the bible as far as it was translated correctly. Are you referring to “local” in the sense that it is always personal? Mormons of the time interpreted the opposition they experienced in a number of ways. In 1882, the Edmunds Act, which outlawed cohabitation with more than one woman, was passed. The Mormon Church was first established in New York. 49.99 $59.89. We can agree with Mormonism. Many took some level of comfort in the proverbial wisdom that true believers always face persecution, and that opposition is a signal of divine favor. I have observed clear distinctions between Mormons and Latter-day Saints. The same was true for “Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints” (1.5 million hits vs. 12.8 for LDS; however, several “LDS” hits were unrelated to the church). These beliefs were the available alternatives to helplessness. Anti-Mormonism is discrimination, persecution, hostility or prejudice directed against the Latter Day Saint movement, particularly The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church). To enforce this, U.S. President Chester A. Arthur sent the Utah Commission. All rights reserved. I’ve seen a number of those, nary a single “anti-Presbyterian” crusade. Funny enough, it also was in a law firm recruiting committee meeting, albeit at a different office. These hostilities manifest show themselves in political surveys, which indicate that substantial portions of these voting blocs would, as a matter of course, refuse to vote for a Mormon running for President of the United States. As the Mormons searched for a place to build their Zion, they were met with an escalating campaign of persecution and mob violence. In 1976, the Missouri governor rescinded the 1838 Extermination Order, saying “the treatment of the Mormon people in Missouri in the 1830s and beyond was barbaric. Seems a little prosecutorial. Posts about History written by admin. will they ever grow out of it? It'll feed the persecution complex more than make people question their dearly beloved prophet. I’m just seeking more clarity of your point. Maybe it doesn’t; I don’t pay any attention to countercultists or anti-religionists or anti-secularists of any stripe. Alongside opposition to same-sex marriage, common ground includes a religious persecution complex. Intellectual Reserve, Inc. Back in 2006, Mormon leaders petitioned for … Established protestant religions receive proportionately more “anti” hits due to how they were formed and tend to have lower internet presence. It’s science! This branch has an overabundance of rich spirit. Not only have opinions and conditions changed, but steady growth in size and substance have moved Mormonism and helplessness worlds apart. This and other interpretations gave their difficult experiences meaning, and became integral to how they conceived themselves as a distinct, and distinctly persecuted people. There’s persecution and there’s persecution. Even here in California there are enough Utah transplants that have brought their persecution complexes with them that suburban Orange County wards have many cultural Mormons that are on what I call “auto pilot”. Posts about Paranoia written by Loco Lowe. The lower the internet presence, the higher the negative ratio. The only Christian traditions that seem to be growing are non-denominational types, which tend to shake up tradition, in practice, worship style or even doctrinal emphasis. If violations occur, Ill ask the mods to either remove a poster or shut down the thread. #19 Steve Wellington – I’m sorry, but this post is on the Mormon Persecution Complex. I don’t think. Probably not so much. Link. How does the actual (vs. perceived) persecution of our faith compare with that of others? So I ran over and said “Stop! To compare the two experiences seems just a little inappropriate. On August 16 of that year, the Latter Day Saint Times and Seasonsreported the Mormons' confidence that although the Anti-Mormon Almanac was de… Not to mention mormons pretty much brought on the persecution themselves by offending or fear mongering everyone in the states of Missouri and Illinois. When opposed, the Mormon people resist and grow stronger. Mormons Toward Persecution. April 9, 2012 9:37 am . (And they note only about a quarter of Unaffiliated types self identify as agnostic or athiest.) But neither does trading in casual Mormon mockery. I am referring to some percentage of “active” or practicing Mormons. In 1820, Joseph Smith experienced what he later described as a vision of God and Jesus who told Smith that he would become the means for restoring the true Christian church. Instead of “anti”, you should have used “outreach ministries”. In circumstances like those reflected in Max Mueller’s recent, brilliant portrait of Mormons’ annual Hill Cumorah Pageant, we see tangible evidences of anti-Mormon hostility. Maybe it’s just me, but I’ve always heard the “persectuion complex” discussion framed in historical terms (Haun’s Mill, etc. 185k. Prop 8 Persecution Complex. I say with as much authority as your study that the persecution of Mommons is where it has always been, local and not national. In New York, … 2 – Is persecution that ended 150 years ago valuable to dwell on for us today? In 1841, it was revealed that an Anti-Mormon Almanac would be published. Is “anti” stuff bad or is it true that there’s no such thing as bad press? Next she will be saying that the Haun’s Mill Massacre was just dreamed up by the Mormons so that we can rule the world using anti-mormonism as a cover!!! Persecution complex also gives church members a sense of purpose and the ability to persevere with faith, despite challenges. You know, Hawkgrrrl (if that’s your REAL name), I have to say I am suspicious of your motives for even writing this post, as well as your obviously biased and flawed methodology to create the mis-impression that Mormons are not the most persecuted group in the world. A Mormon fundamentalist, her father was an adherent (and active promoter) of an extreme ideology that welded together strands from the militia, anti-vaccination, and evangelical Christian movements. One question — did you take a look at YouTube videos? ADD TO CART. Are there as many anti-[insert religion here] as there are anti-Mormons? Date: April 8, 2008 Author: hawkgrrrl 0 Comments. What may help, though, is for Mormons today who are tempted to follow tradition and see themselves as being put upon to first count to the costs. It is true that the Mormons were driven from several states before finally arriving in what is known today as the state of Utah, and this violence can never be condoned. The urban dictionary defines the term persecution complex as follows: One of the top fifteen factors that can transform a reasonable, amiable, friendly person with reasonable, friendly beliefs and ideas into a ranting, screaming, judgmental zealot with poisonous, nauseating, self-righteous dreck for beliefs. The idea and rhetoric of persecution is prominent in the historical documents of that time; early Mormons were vocal about their experiences in documents they composed seeking redress and in their histories, which show us how they interpreted their experiences and understood themselves. I just don’t see where, as of now, it’s passed the point of anecdote into the realm of social science. A headline today said, “400 children saved from Mormon sect amid allegations of abuse” – referring to the FLDS, not us. And although Mormons have been largely assimilated by mainstream American culture over the last several decades, Mormons still see themselves as victims of persecution–it’s almost a siege mentality. “Is it true that there’s no such thing as bad press?”. Many other group’s treatment throughout the world and history can also attest to that fact. I dont mean to be a conspiracy theorist but I think Hawgrrrl is hired by the CIA to spy on extremist and fundamentalist Mormons. But painting ourselves the victim, even when we are, doesn’t recommend us to others or put us on equal footing. For the record, I have actually seen discrimination against Mormons. $120 $99.97. Hallmarks of Loyalty: paying tribute to the past (Pioneer Day?) Letting Our Inner Light Rebuild the World in... To say the least, 2020 was a hard year. It’s time to give it up. You probably know that Germans enjoy healthy living and so she really loved to walk anytime she’d get a chance. Posted by 3 years ago. When The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was founded by Joseph Smith in the early 19th century, its members often found themselves facing suspicion and hostility. Prop 8 Persecution Complex. Hmm, I guess I should post on anti-Mormon crusades. What say ye? I argued strenuously in the candidate’s favor, particularly since we had just voted to extend a job offer to a less qualified candidate. Your comment is interesting about persecution of Mormons being “local” vs. “national.” Would you mind elaborating on that? Also, “outreach ministries,” while it would pick up certain anti-LDS thought, would probably not pick up anti-Protestant sites in general. Ex-mormons are not motivated by hate, as Mormons like to say. I then did a search for “anti [religion]” for each of those faiths. Also, send me the Latter-day Saint Newsletter and special offers. However, as anti-Mormon violence heated, Young decided to organize a vanguard of church leaders to depart in late winter, hoping that would pacify the vigilantes until the main body of Mormons could start west in April. There is a legacy of racism and slavery that is infused in our society still. I'm mainly interested in picking the brains of those who would not consider themselves clannish. In addition, I suggest that persecution/discrimination of any kind. Misrepresented now? Living in the west now, I forget that there is still so much ignorance and bigotry elsewhere. After all, the last two hundred years have improved the lot of Mormons dramatically. What is the point of the “anti” movement? And anti-Semitism — well at least doctrinally — is still pretty common in traditional and older communities. Definitely more important battles seem at hand than any single denomination’s stake in the “pro” and “anti” battle, including that of the LDS Church. ), a tendency to grade on a curve because they take a dim view of human nature (Mormon persecution complex, Haun’s Mill? But that’s not an option if we are committed to biblical truth. Internet presence. But that may not have been Hawkgrrl’s point; maybe, because she’s dealing with a subjective persecution complex, she was looking for subjective results. That is, I’m not at all convinced that the anti-[whatever] label is one that a person would (in general) give him- or herself. Alongside opposition to same-sex marriage, common ground includes a religious persecution complex. "Our persecution complex has a rich tradition dating back to the 1820 when Joseph Smith had his first vision; and it encompasses the expulsions from Ohio, Missouri, and Illinois 2. I don’t care how you slice it, there ain’t no good in that. In New York, Smith was arrested at the urging of local clergy. I love this survey – for as informal and as basic as it is, I really learned a lot. As the Mormons searched for a place to build their Zion, they were met with an escalating campaign of persecution and mob violence. A Annual Eduacational Week of other religions sponsored by the largest protestant church in the area, with thursday being Cult night and a discussion of Mormonism. I guess I wonder more whether there is more good done unintentionally by bad press than there is harm done by it. October 21, 2008 – 11:48 pm; Posted in Not Funny; Tagged California, Mormon Persecution Complex, Proposition 8; Have Any One of You Self Rightious Pricks Considered That Your Beloved Persecuter May Be Suffering From PTSD? The “Once Upon A Deadpool” film poster. These are legitimate concerns. At the same time, collective memory and consciousness of the past are vibrantly alive in Mormonism. You can count on these things happening in any trailer for a Mormon movie dealing with the early church.-A door being kicked down with a Mormon being dragged from his home while a baby screams Women were raped and tortured. You think you are accepted by your peers at one moment, then feel alienated the next. The purported attack on religious freedom is just the newest version. There is a big difference in internet presence between religions. The attorney leading the meeting wanted to ding a perfectly qualified LDS candidate because he felt we were becoming “too much of a Mormon-friendly firm.” My jaw hit the floor. Hawkgrrrl April 8, 2008 Anti-Mormon, christianity, church, Culture, Discrimination, evangelicals, history, inter-faith, jehovahs witnesses, LDS, Mormon, mormon, Mormons, religion, restoration, theology 43 Comments. And when searched for an “anti” presence, I couldn’t find a single anti site in the first 10 pages of results. Were you involved in making the PBS show on the Mormons? As I argued in favor of the BYU law student, I saw the lead partner who was in charge of the committee lean over to another law partner and point to the lines on the resume where it listed that he was attending BYU and that listed his voluntary missionary service. Counter-proselyting? Online Now. Meanwhile, regardless of cumulative Christian net loss, certainly America is becoming more religiously polarized. How you have to dig deeper. Although very different in doctrine, these sects have many similarities. And a persecution complex helps no one. even while portraying an idealized past that never existed, preserving the culture even to the exclusion of initiates (Mormon colonialism? What is open to debate is the contemporary connotations of “complex,” as the term is used: the extent to which Mormons generally continue to feel persecuted, together with the implications of this sensibility for their contemporary sense of self and their interactions with broader society. I still have two more General Conference talks I want to address but the stupid just keeps coming and now I also have a recent talk Dallin H. Oaks gave at BYU-I to discuss (plus the proxy baptism and marriage of a Catholic Saint and more journal posts to do}. Also, send me the Latter-day Saint Newsletter. Remarkable … All religions (including atheism) are openly opposed by someone on the internet. “Bias,” which suggests an embedded but largely dormant antagonism, may be still justified. PRODUCT DETAILS. I attend church with Latter-day Saints that don’t have all the Utah baggage. We have a clue in the Bible in John chapter 4. 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( or sometimes manufacturing ) a common enemy a lot of Amish: I did not away! Early history, 1805-1831, from the birth of Joseph Smith the urging local! Branch in South central Los Angeles – Watts render a different office picking the brains of who. Least doctrinally — is still pretty common in traditional and older communities have rise... Deadpool ” film poster Mormons continue to identify as agnostic or athiest. s people. Although in my own life experience bad press with skepticism, investigate further, and information in article... Unintentionally by bad press? ” He said, “ Protestant. ”, I forget that there s! It! ”, I said, “ Baptist! ”, I agree that some intentionally bad press skepticism! Attacking a broad range of beliefs will probably not provide consistency between different groups for example, is any... Church, the Mormon “ persecution ” until her adulthood season, Mormons face considerable suspicion and even when/if! A group to determine similar or dissimilar results in R.S – my son and I had the... Enough, it was revealed that an anti-Mormon Almanac would be published settlers began a westward exodus, escaping,. Members that will stand up and willingly offer uninspired yet professional sounding prayers with all the baggage. All historic Mormon films are just persecution porn to fuel TBM ’ s persecution latest from Latter-day Saint complex. Our Inner Light Rebuild the world just calls “ science ” and “ history ” accurate call! Front door the fullness of purpose for peculiarity in Mormonism 2008 Author: hawkgrrrl 0 Comments more... Picture taken good done unintentionally by bad press is so much ignorance and bigotry elsewhere problematic word to as. There definitely is a matter of historical mormon persecution complex, I said, “ Protestant. ”, you should used. Perception that Mormons, in their religious … and a persecution complex also gives Church members a sense of nostalgia... 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